Where is the Line between Toxic and just Salty?

Wasn’t sure where to post this Long ass Post, tried in Discord, buuut I wrote more then 2000 words, so here we are instead

I kinda want the opinions of the community on …let’s call it 2 “interactions” I’ve had

First one, let me set the screen:

Player 13, claims D1 Knight (he is 2nd D1 knight claims)
then late game, he is found to be Incomp with player 6

then he claims Chrono and that he delayed the death of player 5, his only argument is that he delayed 5, don’t post logs or anything called BD imbeciles, and says nothing other than “5 can confirm me” (5 is very slow to confirm this so 13 get exed, and he flips Chronomancer )

Then!
In dead chat, I tell him, that next time just post full logs (since going over the same line again, and again, and again only makes you look bad, right)

His reaction to that is “bullshit” there was nothing that could save him,
I try to counter argue with that’s its still much better to just post logs, then repeating the same thing over and over

that escalates into “I should not give useless advice”
Clearly I don’t think its useless to explain why a specific behaviour is bad, and asking questions about that behaviour
quickly turns into that “I cant comprehend English”
you know the full on “I don’t have anything to argue with so I’m Just going to do personal attacks instead”

He could simply had said “I disagree”

Now I don’t know if this guy is new, or vet or something in between, I think I’ve seen him a few times before
all i know is, I do not wish not play with him anymore (not that I can really do anything to avoid him)

And when the game ended, I gave him a report for “game throwing - Fake claiming Knight as Chronomancer”
(and something about shit posting)

I feel like its a Toxic behaviour and for the most party Ruins the game alltogether
well mostly I guess I’m annoyed by the the way he “argues” cant stay on topic, and defaults to be a gramma Nazi

what do you guys think?
is it a perfectly reasonable reaction?, is it a Minor thing, Don’t care ? or are you in the same boat as me, and find it super annoying
that people are so narrow minded, they believe that they, and they alone knows what is rights and everyone else is just bad
I encounter this more frequently as of late,

last Week a streamer told me I played the game wrong, always fun when the Big boys are calling you out on stream
he got 3300 hours played, and I “only” got 1200 hours, clearly I don’t know how the game works, and needs to be told by a grow up

What was the “wrong play” you asked ?

I outed as INQ D1,
I stab King, Night 1, killes him
Vote Pretender for King
I whisper the Newly elected Pretender King “hey lets go for a neut only win” - hes down
2 or 3 days later he tell me he is PK

we continue to stab people untill we win (and we did)

then in prelobby, le streamer, salty as ever, tells me “I need to stick to objective, simple as that”
despite I won with the play I made, it was stll very wrong

And now I don’t want to play with that guy anymore, telling me how I should have my fun

what both players seems to forget,
we play this game for fun, to relax (streamer aside, but the rest of us, the other 15 players, to have fun)

and being shit on, for no reason, is not fun

Over and out //Netulven

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I’m sure that must have been frustrating to you, however I must point out that the first person probably sees you as you see the second person.

2 Likes

Gonna say that report on the first player was a false report he didn’t gamethrow at all

FMPOV it feels like you just want to have people tell you that they agree with you completely

I get that, and to be honest, i did re-read before posting and I can see why you would think that,
but I decided to post it anyways to see what reactions it would bring,

I would hope everyone agrees on that we play the game for Fun,
and Toxic behavior is bad

Question is, when is a player Toxic, and when is a player just Salty or you can ask when is a player (in this case me) being “overly sensitive” about the situation

going into the argument with the First player, I didn’t intent to start a fight, or tell him “how to play” but a suggestion how to avoid getting exe’d in the next game

he took that very poorly, and I guess both went to a “Deference stand” from there on
At the very least I tried to keep a civil and sober tone, unlike he did

But in the 2nd case, Yes I really want people to agree that streamers should not hold the “power” to tell people how to play the game,

TOL community inst big, and having around 65-ish people watching your stream and “agreeing” with everything the stream says, can be damaging to the game if the streamer is imposing his view

Not helping, not having an opinion, but dictating how the game should be played

On the day that happened, I was considering making an post just about that
1200 hours in, and now i don’t feel like playing the game, because the “important” people don’t like the way I play
I’ve watched a bit of his stream, and IMO, his a bit shit to people, so I was hoping someone else had similar feelings about that topic

at the end of it all,
If everyone post here says that I’m Wrong, then I’ll have something to reconsider :slight_smile:

I disagree on that

By faking claiming a Knight, he loses all credibility as a blue dragon, so when he is on the stand, with a different claim and his only Argument is “I delayed 5” no logs, and when 5 isent Confirming him, he dont try to prove his innocent, he just gets mad

tha’ts not helping, I see that as Borderline intentionally going against your goal. ( 9 in TOS)

as the go ol Loading tips also say something in the line of
Keep clam, and post logs

which he again refused,

Oh yeah, I can add that in Dead chat
he said “I do what i want”
to which i replied, “then you got take the actions of that” (my wording was a bit of, but basically i was saying to each actions there is a equal reaction"

and I’m all for you do you, but don’t get mad when it then fails
and TBH, had he not resort to trash talking, I would not have given him a report, but “each action…”
and lets face it, If I’m the bad guy, and I’m the only report he ever gotten, he’ll be fine

I cant really speak about the situation, because never been there, ya know, without knowing the situation from both sides, its kinda just a paper with one blotch of paint.

First part, now full posting logs is doable and indeed a way to make ppl think you’re town. But from that person’s view, full posting logs wasn’t a choice when either way getting delayed was the only proof he had of him being Chrono.

Getting lynched as town will invoke far more negative feelings then if you were lynched as neut or evil. And when people are angry, or frustrated, they’re more likely to blow their top and their cognitive mind will just go kapoof.

Of course, there is the chance that he’s just taking whatever things out on you, but don’t count on it. Chances are, they’re just red hot in the moment, and therefore they’re literally stuck in that mindset and cannot move onwards.

Learn to recognise that… I think there are a few ways of communicating with such people without pouring oil onto the fire… but don’t count my word for it. I have my ways.

I’ll talk about the streamer thing in a sec.

The Knight thing, yes, in the meta, bad. I mean, I’m pretty sure even through ToL’s second anniversary, it’s still

“LolKnights”
Right?

Perhaps, but that don’t change the fact that he could argue using a sober tone, instead of going off topic telling people they are Illiterate. and no English is not my first language, so yes there will be misspellings and grammar errors(Hell I do even more mistakes in my mothertoung tbh) , but if the recipient understand what I’m saying, its not a relavant to bring in the grammer at all

Some ppl cant handle when they’re getting lynched
Like
Super cannot take it
They’ll be like
WTF TOWN TRASHHH UUUUUU

You’ll be surprised how anger blinds people

I should answer the question :stuck_out_tongue:

surprisingly not in this game,

2x D1 Knight claims, and the first one was killed …like night 5 or something like it, and then the fake claim, got exed 1 or 2 days after
dont remember the excat nights/day
but none were killed just because “lolknight” :slight_smile:

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No need to worry about the specifics, because I’m just a random forumer who played ToL during the MoonMoon boom days… Imma post some more…

Cant say I’m 100% Zen either, but I’ll try to just yell at the screen instead of going on in chat :slight_smile:

If I’m interpreting this right…

Is not correct. It’s really in the wrong cat imo.

That was no Gamethrow.
Fake Claiming Knight does lose you some credibility
But, iirc, if he had insisted “IM A KNIGHT DOUCHEBAGS” even after the whole thing, then yes, that’s gamethrowing, especially if invests had checked his type.

But he truth telled, and possibly repeated the one thing that would save him (because fake logs is actually easy to make) that someone else can confirm. (Which, malarkey, that someone was unfortunately… not on the faster side.)

That in itself should make it clear that he had no intention to gamethrow…

However, when he yelled at you for whatever reasons, and then goes onto “Buh buh cant speku…”, That’s reportable. That’s under abusive chat? (Pardon me I haven’t played ToL in a long time). Anyway that category.

You meant well, but P1’s there being angry, time heals as per see. He won’t see the value until much later anyway, and then again, some people are stubborn.

Oh, and FYI (For your info)

Shitposting is not yelling at people.

Shitposting refers to absolute memes and fluff posts in chat.

Yea I know “shitposting is an art”
I just find its easier to say shit posting, then “he talked a lot of shit” :slight_smile:

Also I appreciate your feedback Shurian :slight_smile:

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Meanings different so u need to watch out

No prob :slight_smile: