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What is it about human psychology that compels so many Scorneds to claim Scorned and expect clemency?


#1

I’m talking about Scorneds that haven’t yet won. You always see that Scorned who gets executed for claiming Scorned before they even won, to either Prince or Mystic. As if they expect to be allowed to live and frame an innocent BD target? Lol? Why?


#2

:man_shrugging:


#3

Because people suddenly become idiots whenever they play scorned.


#4

Scorned is the new alch claim.

/shrug


#5

I become a god when I play Scorned, just like me being a god when I was an Executioner in Town of Salem (Yes, I used to play ToS before I got into ToL, sue me)


#6

Because many people see them as just Neutral classes rather than evil ones. Funny thing is, this shit is also ridiculously common in ToS, more so than ToL as the average player skill is far lower than ToL.

The thing is, the optimal play in mafia-like games such as this when it comes to neutrals is to outright lynch them provided they give no advantages to the majority faction as aside from getting a suspect out, you’re also killing someone who has no drawbacks from siding with evil, has a wincon who sets the good faction backwards, or even requires them to lose for their wincon.

In ToS, you should always execute Witches, Executioners, Jesters(At night, duh), Survivors, and Guardian Angels provided they are on a person who isn’t confirmed. Meanwhile you should spare Amnesiacs while Pirates fall under a weird spot as they’re technically anti-Town unless they’re given a target.

While in ToL, you pretty much should always execute Sellswords, Scorneds, and Fools(Again, at night) as they all fall on the latter. Mercenaries and Alchemists should be spared as they fall on the former case. Inquisitors are on a weird spot as they can auto-confirm themselves and begin aligned with BD until they win, where they can select to help either faction.


#7

If you want to truly understand something, theorising in a vacuum isn’t terribly good, as you will default to a scenario that fits your preconceptions. Instead, try imagining different scenarios.

If you are a Scorned and it’s not early game anymore, one of your targets is dead and the other is confirmed BD (for example, an outed Mystic or Noble that the evils have steered away from converting), it’s only a matter of time before a Knight/Alch/Inquisitor bombs you or Butler/Drunk occupies/redirects you, and finds out you’re immune, destroying whatever claim you may have. At that point, it might be beneficial to offer BD a trade: execute the Social class that may not be providing them with too much value and can be converted later, and you side with them against evils. Evils cannot convert you and will have a difficult time killing you, so provided you follow your end of the bargain, you can be a strong asset to BD, similar to an Alchemist.

After all, “kill my target and I will side with BD” is exactly the same proposal the Inquisitor implicitly makes. The only difference is that the Inquisitor’s target is the NK, which BD wants to kill anyway, while you’re asking them to turn on one of their own, so it better be done at a point where BD numbers aren’t looking that good and your target isn’t pulling their weight.

This is a scenario that happens a lot more frequently than you think and where outing yourself as Scorned and offering BD a choice is a lot more likely to get you the win than trying to frame/accuse a confirmed BD that everyone is rallying behind.

Now as to why out yourself early game? Probably because the person doesn’t actually enjoy playing Scorned, as it is a fairly straightforward class with little interaction, and just wants to either get a pity win or get executed quickly so that they can leave to join another game.


#8

ShadowKnight V.S Sarun

Fight!


#9

Nah fam, I’m good. :smiley:


#10

At that point, it might be beneficial to offer BD a trade: execute the Social class that may not be providing them with too much value and can be converted later, and you side with them against evils. Evils cannot convert you and will have a difficult time killing you, so provided you follow your end of the bargain, you can be a strong asset to BD,

In short, execute a confirmed BD, one with strong self-confirming abilities at that, for the promise, that which can easily be broken as you’re not faction-bound, that you will vote with them as a Scorned, a class that has no useful abilities to BD whatsoever and could be an evil hiding behind a fakeclaim. This is just a bad idea all around.

converted later,

Finding a Noble/Mystic>CL is extremely easy and for the Unseen you should always be trying to find the MM as that’s the only way to stop people from getting converted.

similar to an Alchemist.

Which can be useful to BD with healing and bombs and doesn’t need to get a BD member executed in order to win.

After all, “kill my target and I will side with BD” is exactly the same proposal the Inquisitor implicitly makes.

I… what? I think I just got a brain aneurysm from reading that. You’re comparing BD executing one of their own with executing the damn NK. The reason why Inquisitors are tolerated by BD and even cooperate with them is because both sides are sharing that one goal. The Scorned is an entire different ballgame as the entire reason for that class is to manipulate BD into executing one of their own, which will set BD backwards.

so it better be done at a point where BD numbers aren’t looking that good and your target isn’t pulling their weight.

In this scenario, BD just can’t intentionally execute one of their own. If they lack numbers with a BD and sans a Scorned then they also lack numbers with a Scorned along with one less BD. And you’re also wasting a day executing a BD.

This is a scenario that happens a lot more frequently than you think and where outing yourself as Scorned and offering BD a choice is a lot more likely to get you the win than trying to frame/accuse a confirmed BD that everyone is rallying behind.

In this scenario it’s typically better to side with the Cult/Unseen. The only reason why a Scorned should side with BD is if their target is an obvious convert.

TL;DR - The Scorned is a cut-and-dry anti-BD class. There’s no way that a Scorned can help the Blue Dragon.

Plus, if you can’t get them executed by conventional means, the best secondary idea is to wait until BD is nearly losing and then use a TB to ask the Unseen/Cult/NK to help you execute your target.


#11

Sarun Wins!

Solely because that post took 24 minutes to make, but still.


#12

:trophy:
Here ya go.
As for Shadow…:fool:tality!


#13

So did a lot of us


#14

In the meantime I’m just gonna let Sarun speak the truth lol


#15

I still play ToS sometimes. I like it cuz I can be playing in like 20 seconds and it’s super chill. Most people here accept it is also a good game.


#16

same


#17

I dont like it because p much everyone throws.


#18

Not true! I was throwing the match ALMOST every time. There is difference. :rage:


#19

Which is why I’m glad that ToL has a paywall.


#20

They really dont, everyone always exaggerates it. ToL has less toxicity yes, but I’d say I only come across a thrower or spammer 1 in 5 games max in ToS.